Harvey 26/05

**Joined:** Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:56 am **Warnings:** 0

redrum666 wrote:

Well I think this game can be split into two distinct sections for me- Entertainment value and gameplay value.

In entertainment terms, this game had it all- Harvey was a brilliant character, he was funny and the banter between him, Noel and the rest of the contestants was hilarious. On par with some of the classic comedy games of all time (Clive, Eunice, Pat M and the likes...) Best of all, there wasn't a single teary-eye in sight, even after Harvey's box had been opened. Regrets but no major disappointment or histrionics... that was great.

However, in gameplay terms, Harvey really disappointed- on the wings he had seemed like the type of person who knew how to read the board perfectly and although he did give some dodgy advice at times, most of it was good. His dithering over the 3rd offer was worrying and when it came to the 4th offer (which I knew he would deal because I read the spoilers) I kept clinging onto a vain hope that Divvy had lied to us and that Harvey would see the offer for what it was- derisory.

But, alas, he accepted it when an offer nearer to £40,000 was what I'd have looked for and what most people would have looked for- then again, compared to some of the deals we've seen recently, this was brilliant!

On the whole, a thoroughly entertaining show that was let down by a terrible deal... I thought Harvey would've seen the potential in the board but, no, like so many before him he saw the pound signs flashing in front of his eyes and grabbed the £20,000. Shame really, I honestly believed Harvey could've been a big winner with the right boxes- and he had the right boxes too, he just bailed out too easily.

Spot on redrum. I didn't like Harvey in the wings at all. too much waffle and pointless "advice", and I turned on today hoping he'd get spank

ed, but within a few minutes I was really rooting for him, what great entertainment, and the banter with Noel was brilliant, he played it perfectly today too.

I did predict on here a while back that Harvey woukld walk with a nice sum, and possibly blow it, and that's what happened. However I did lose a lot of respect for him at two points. First, when he said "I'm a gambler, as you know" no Harvery, you most certainly are not.

Second, when he was looking to blow the game apart, and remembered he'd forgotten Penny Arcade and reverted to the system, having already realised he forgot it and played on before. Why didn't he go back to the system then?. That was a bit dishonest, for my money, and I'm glad he blew the biggii. Just out of curiosity, anyone following the stats work out how the game would have ended if he'd opened that box at the right time?

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 5:32 pm **Author:** James1978 **Post subject:**

The board at the third offer was just like arrogant Jeff's when he got offered £30,000 - Harvey was offered £16,500 and considered it for yonks.

The board at the 4th offer was just like Khanny's (indeed slightly better) when he was offered 48k, and Harvey DEALT 20k.

Surely some of these contestants have been watching the show from back then and knew the board was worth a heck of a lot more (though I don't expect anyone to get offers as good as Khanny's, they shouldn't be less than half than dealt)!!

30K is a psycholgical barrier as well so even if he'd dealt 30-35K on that board it would have felt a lot better than a stale targetist 20-25K deal

Still I guess Craig from a year ago had a similar board and offer and 'got away with it'.

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 5:57 pm **Author:** Simon F **Post subject:**

Having read the spoilers, I knew the result of today's show but I don't think it was that bad a deal because of the remark the banker made about if Harvey had taken out the £250k after no-dealing at 8 box, he would get a derisory offer (which he did - I wouldn't have dealt at £7k at 5 box).

So, turning down £20k at 8 box, you are really looking towards 2 box. If we call the 3 low reds as oranges for simplicity you have

11% chance of red/red finish
32% chance of red/orange
21% chance of red/blue
11% chance of orange/orange
21% chance of orange/blue
4% chance of blue/blue

64% chance of keeping one of the top 3 in play 2 box (which would probably be £20k minimum) - I'd probably go on but certainly not a stupid decision.

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 6:06 pm **Author:** Dr. Hindsight **Post subject:**

Why does this keep happening? Why? My brother thinks that some of these kinds of players are "allergic" to winning big money. I'm inclined to agree. He blew it big time, and his pre-deal speech of "I am a gambler. Deal." was very oxymoronic. But regardless, £20,000 is still good money, regardless of whether you make a good deal or not. Still, this could have been a big-money game if Harvey had the guts to play on. Had it been me at the Pound Table, I would have gone straight to the end.

**Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2006 10:04 pm **Warnings:** 0

I'd seen the spoiler for this a while ago so remembered he made a fairly weak deal for a £100k box.

Good character but if that's the definition of a "gambler" these days then I think I'm just about done with this show. Sorry to sound like Basicasic but that's the truth...

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 6:15 pm **Author:** Dr. Hindsight **Post subject:**

Power5 wrote:

I'd seen the spoiler for this a while ago so remembered he made a fairly weak deal for a £100k box.

Good character but if that's the definition of a "gambler" these days then I think I'm just about done with this show. Sorry to sound like Basicasic but that's the truth...

Very well said, Power5. Deal USA is beginning to have the same effects on me as well. If anything, Harvey was a reverse gambler, I guess. I'm sure he was a likeable guy, though.

**Joined:** Sat May 19, 2007 6:23 pm **Warnings:** 0

Harvey was brilliant; his banter was awesome, I just wish he'd have declined the £20,000. The £7,000 would certainly have made him go on, so he'd have won at least £40,000!

**Joined:** Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:19 pm **Warnings:** 0

redrum666 wrote:

Well I think this game can be split into two distinct sections for me- Entertainment value and gameplay value.

In entertainment terms, this game had it all- Harvey was a brilliant character, he was funny and the banter between him, Noel and the rest of the contestants was hilarious. On par with some of the classic comedy games of all time (Clive, Eunice, Pat M and the likes...) Best of all, there wasn't a single teary-eye in sight, even after Harvey's box had been opened. Regrets but no major disappointment or histrionics... that was great.

However, in gameplay terms, Harvey really disappointed- on the wings he had seemed like the type of person who knew how to read the board perfectly and although he did give some dodgy advice at times, most of it was good. His dithering over the 3rd offer was worrying and when it came to the 4th offer (which I knew he would deal because I read the spoilers) I kept clinging onto a vain hope that Divvy had lied to us and that Harvey would see the offer for what it was- derisory.

But, alas, he accepted it when an offer nearer to £40,000 was what I'd have looked for and what most people would have looked for- then again, compared to some of the deals we've seen recently, this was brilliant!

On the whole, a thoroughly entertaining show that was let down by a terrible deal... I thought Harvey would've seen the potential in the board but, no, like so many before him he saw the pound signs flashing in front of his eyes and grabbed the £20,000. Shame really, I honestly believed Harvey could've been a big winner with the right boxes- and he had the right boxes too, he just bailed out too easily.

Umm... Nuff said.

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 7:13 pm **Author:** h2005 **Post subject:**

It was a good show and Harvey was an entertaining contestant who undoubtedly provided some good banter with Noel, the audience, the banker and the contestants. However, for someone who was supposed to be a gambler and a good board reader, I thought his deal was fairly weak.

It wasn't a stupid decision to deal, but it wasn't a stupid decision to no deal (as his pre-dealing "speech" implied). With the top 3 in play, low reds as backups and only a couple of blues - both of which were high blues, I'd have thought it was worth going on. As it happened, he'd have had a nasty round but would've turned things around at 2-box and would've won at least £40,000 - I suspect most people would've won £100k with £10k as a backup.

In terms of entertainment value, a very good start to the week, but in terms of gameplay, a fairly poor start to the week. It's not so much the fact that he had £100k in his box that's the problem in my opinion, it's more that he dealt a fairly poor offer on a fairly stable board when he was supposed to be an analyst. As Power5 implied in an earlier post, it's not very good really if such a "good board reader" thought that offer was good for the board when it should've been about £35k. Hopefully the coming week will provide some cracking shows like Betty's week did.

**Joined:** Thu Nov 22, 2007 6:04 pm **Warnings:** 0

A fun game to watch but a shocking deal to be honest.

I would have so much more respect for a contestant who said, 'It's a great board and there may be more in it but I'm not prepared to take any chance with 20 thousand (or whatever it may be)' and was then indifferent to the proveout, shrugging their shoulders to however the boxes fell, happy that they've won an amount that was important to them. As it is so many players make feeble deals and then whoop with delight if the board fall apart or go into a slough of despond if they have big amounts in their box. If Harvey was happy with 20k then why get worked up about what might have been?

**Joined:** Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:46 pm **Warnings:** 0

As most people have said this was a great game entertainment wise, but gameplay wise it was a bit of a safe deal.

I've been a fan of Harvey whilst he was on the wings and I was looking forward to his game and whilst I did feel he should of gone on at that stage he still provided one of the most entertaining games in a while. The game in general felt happy and fun, unlike some of recent times, and he had a like-ability factor about him.

It'd be great though if we could mix the 2 elements and have a great entertaining game with a massive win.

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 8:24 pm **Author:** harryfielder **Post subject:**

I had a feeling No 1 had a big prize :oops:

and as Harvey kept saying..
''One for the Money''....

Aitch,

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 8:56 pm **Author:** jiveclive **Post subject:**

Have you got any pics of Davey Joel yet?

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 9:20 pm **Author:** basicasic **Post subject:**

I look back on that show with a certain amount of ambivalence towards Harvey. He was entertaining and fun and the show was great to watch but his deal was a shocker.

I feel almost as disappointed with that deal as I was with Richards. Not because it was as bad (it was no where near) but because I expected better from Harvey. As a wise oracle on the wings who dished out advice freely to others he appeared to be able to assess the board in order to make an informed decision on an offer. Today I thought the offers for the board were dreadful, yet he seemed to think they were good. He claimed he was a gambler, but not stupid and proved exactly the opposite with a truly awful cop-out.

The board was strong with good backup. There was a high chance of a decent get-out if he had a disasterous round. And of course the chance to win £100,000. Which he would have.

The halcyon days of the show that we all remember and love are gone for good I fear. I've kept the faith for a long time now in the hope that the good times return. I don't think they will.

**Posted:** Mon May 26, 2008 9:22 pm **Author:** basicasic **Post subject:**

jiveclive wrote:

Have you got any pics of Davey Joel yet?

Not before the 9 o'clock watershed please. Children could get nightmares!

**Joined:** Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:51 pm **Warnings:** 0

Power5 wrote:

I'd seen the spoiler for this a while ago so remembered he made a fairly weak deal for a £100k box.

Good character but if that's the definition of a "gambler" these days then I think I'm just about done with this show. Sorry to sound like Basicasic but that's the truth...

Very well put.

Another one for the hall of shame. *sigh*

**Joined:** Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:55 pm **Warnings:** 0

As people has said, that was certainly a game of two halves. Harvey turned out to be an entertaining character, and the banter between Noel and the wings was great, and for the majority of the show it was very watchable and enjoyable, and one of the best shows in quite a while. However, the deal was speculative to say the least on a board with the top 3 intact, and I thought Harvey would have a much bolder approach to his game and analyse the board to a greater extent, but instead he continued the decidedly mediocre cycle of pretty weak deals. With the top 3 at that stage, I would have to have a good reason to deal, whereas he seemed to be thinking, "I have £20k, there's no reason why I should no-deal".

I just don't see why more players don't analyse the board, as surely the game was intended for people to do that at least a bit (indeed the US version encourages it by flashing up the odds - maybe that's a route we should go down), and it is frustrating that players can't make the statistically correct decisions, it's more a case of "Oh well, I've made the wrong decision, but hopefully I'll get away with it".

There are plenty of shows that offer modest sums of money without weighing up risks/ probabilities, but surely the skill in this game lies in determining a good deal from a bad one, or does that not matter anymore. Should they ask questions instead...?

watching it he definitely seemed seduced by the money like most contestants do he only saw it in it's raw amount and was unable to way it up against the board.

20K is a great amount of money granted but didn't think about the potential gain and a possible get out and why it might be worth having a better punt at the three huge sums.

and it's the banker's 'fault' as well for offering that threat. More people should try and stuff him anyway but that just encourages deals.

**Posted:** Tue May 27, 2008 12:05 am **Author:** h2005 **Post subject:**

I think Richard's deal could have a serious knock-on effect in terms of the banker's offers. The banker said after Richard's game he thought no-one on the wings currently would win more than £20,000. To prove his point, I think he may be trying to avoid offering more than £20k whenever he can.

Today's 8-box board was worthy of an offer well into the £30 - £40k region, and the £3,500 increase from 3rd to 4th offer after a very good round showed dis-proportionate generosity, which makes me suspect the banker's stopping point is going to be £20,000 as much as possible now, to prove his point.

Harvey was also a "board reader" / advice giver, so the banker should really have been scared of him and offered a lot more at 8-box. The banker may have thought Harvey would no deal, and threw in a nice-looking £20k offer which was bad for the board to test out whether Harvey really was an analyst or whether he was a targetist, and clearly the latter proved to be the case.

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Harvey 26/05

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